How Jenn Donahue Built Empathy Driven Leadership in a Male-Dominated Military-47
Ever wondered what it takes for a "quiet, bookish" girl to command thousands across combat zones? In this inspiring episode of Dog Tag Diaries, Dr. Jenn Donahue—retired Navy captain, civil engineer, and self-described Texas wild thing—breaks the mold. Jenn shares powerful stories about being "the only woman in the room," her unexpected journey into military leadership, and how embracing authenticity reshaped her idea of true leadership.
From building bridges in Iraq to tackling impostor syndrome on center stage, Jenn offers rare insights into navigating male-dominated spaces, finding mentorship, leading with empathy, and balancing career ambition with family and self-care. Ready to discover why real greatness is about lifting others up, not proving your worth? Tune in and hear how one woman rewrote the rules of military success, resilience, and personal growth.
Jenn Donahue, PhD is a retired US Navy Captain and former Commodore for an 1,800 personnel Regiment. She is also a civil engineer who works on large scale, high profile geotechnical projects. Over her 27-year military career, Jenn has built a bridge across the Euphrates River in the midst of the Iraq war, commanded an 800-personnel Battalion in Afghanistan, and constructed combat outposts in the middle of deserts filled with insurgents.
Jenn passionately helps others overcome the obstacles that prevent them from achieving their grandest dreams and most ambitious goals. She is an international keynote speaker with speeches including leadership and mindset.
Today, Jenn is the Founder of JL Donahue Engineering, Inc. and Dare to Rise. She also lectures at UC Berkeley, UCLA, and CalPoly.
🔗 Connect with Jenn Donahue:
🌐 Website: jenndonahue.com
🔗 LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/jenndonahue-phd-pe
📘 Stay tuned for her upcoming book, launching late 2025!
Kim Liska served in the United States Army/Reserves as a Combat Medic, Combat Nurse, Flight Nurse Instructor and one of the Top Female athletes in the Army. Kim worked 20+ years as an ER nurse and decided to explore the world as a travel nurse. She's an Advanced Wilderness Expedition Provider and Chief Medical Officer for numerous endurance/survival expeditions in different countries. Kim has a son, Jace and a daughter in law, Sammy and 2 grand animals, Joey & Bear. Her dog Camo is her best buddy. Camo is the sweetest yellow Labrador Retriever to walk this earth. He loves licking snow, riding the ocean waves, visiting carnivore food trucks and loves belly rubs and treats. Fun Facts: Kim's lived in the Reality TV World! Fear Factor, American Ninja Warrior-Military Edition, American Tarzan, Spartan Namibia and more to come!
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Transcript
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Kim [:What happens when a quiet bookish girl with a love for building grows up to command thousands of troops in combat zones and still battles impostor syndrome behind the scenes. Meet doctor Jenn Donahue, a retired navy captain, civil engineer, and self described wild thing from Texas A And M who broke barriers as one of the few women in the military's elite civil engineer corps. From building bridges in Iraq to leading battalions in Afghanistan, Jenn's story is one of grit, growth, and discovering that true leadership isn't about proving your worth. It's about creating greatness in others. In this episode, she opens up about what it means to be the only in the room, how to lead with empathy instead of ego, and why embracing who you are rather than trying to fit in is the ultimate act of bravery. Come join us in Jenn's journey. Welcome to Dog Tag Diaries. I'm your host, Captain Kim.
Kim [:Our podcast is where military women speak their truths and share the stories that have shaped their lives. From moments of resilience to hard won triumphs, we hold nothing back. 2024 was a year of incredible milestones for this community. Our voices were heard in over 33 countries around the world, and we ranked in Apple Podcast's top 200 impersonal journeys in The United States, a testament to the power of authentic storytelling. Now as we launch season four, we invite you to journey with us once again. This is more than a podcast. This is a movement. Let's break barriers, shatter silence, and amplify the voices of military women everywhere.
Kim [:Thank you for listening, sharing, and making this possible. This is Dog Tag Diaries. Today's guest is a powerhouse of quiet strength, fierce determination, and undeniable skill. Doctor Jenn Donahue is a retired United States Navy captain and former regimental Commodore who's led engineering teams from four to 1,800 across some of the world's most dangerous terrain, from the deserts of Afghanistan to the battlefields of Iraq. A PhD engineer and founder of her own firm, Jenn has designed earthquake resilience structures around the globe, taught at top universities, and now speaks internationally on leadership and mindset. But what makes her truly remarkable isn't just what she's built, it's who she's become. In a world where she was often the only woman in the room, Jenn learned that the real measure of leadership isn't about proving your own greatness. It's about lifting others up.
Kim [:Today, she's here to talk about her journey, her battles with imposter syndrome, and how to lead with empathy, courage, and authenticity. This is doctor Jenn Donahue. Thank you so much for being on Dog Tag Diaries.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I am so excited to be here. Thank you so much for having me.
Kim [:Oh my gosh. Absolutely. Oh my gosh. And we always start our interviews off with who and how you were as a younger version of you, like this little girl, Jenn. And we do this so the listeners have a better understanding of how you just transform that little you into who you are today. So let's hear it.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I have always been a builder. Like, you know, other little girls they'd like to play with maybe Barbies or something like that. I had Legos and Lincoln logs and erector sets and all of these other things that I've always, always loved building. In fact, when I was eight years old, I actually got a Barbie dream house. But the Barbie dream house wasn't for Barbie. It was for me so that I could build it over and over and over again, and I could cut it up and I could rearrange it. And that's how I was as a little kid. And I love math.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I love science. I am a nerd. I'll just admit it right now, but that's who I was as a little girl.
Kim [:Did your parents encourage all of that?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:My parents didn't know what to do with me. My whole family, they're artists, and they do all of this amazing work. And I'm really the only person in my whole family that knows how to do math. I'm also the only person who knows how to read a map. So anytime, you know, starting at the age of five years old, my parents would just, like, hand me a map and, you know, say, hey. Get us to Wyoming. And I navigate from Texas to Wyoming as, like, a five year old. So I don't think my parents quite knew what was going on.
Kim [:Oh my gosh. That totally must have come in handy with land navigation. And when they gave you the map and the compass and gave you those, grid points.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Oh, yeah. I love land nav. Ben, I am a master at land nav, especially night land nav. Oh, yeah. That's, like, my jam. That was, like, people were, like, I don't wanna go in land nav. I'm, like, hell, yeah. Let's go.
Kim [:Oh my gosh. You and I are gonna go do a mission together here in Bend, Oregon.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Oh, perfect.
Kim [:So how did you discover the military?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:There was really no military in my family for quite some time. You know, obviously, grandfather went bought in World War two. I had an uncle and my stepfather were both drafted for Vietnam. But other than that, there was really no military. And whenever I got to college, I was an ocean engineer. And I started to look at my friends, and they wanted to go down to Houston and get jobs for these big corporations. And I was like, I don't wanna do that. Like, that sounds boring.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I need to go see the world. I wanna get out. I wanna explore. And a friend of mine said, hey. Have you thought about maybe joining the Navy? Because the Navy has a civil engineer corps where they send you all over the world and you build. And I thought, okay. That's perfect. And it was.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I am so glad that I went in that direction because my first duty station was in Guam. I mean, I mean, after going from West Texas to Guam, I mean, that's quite a change.
Kim [:Yeah. Okay. So you started your career in what college?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I went to Texas A and L.
Kim [:Okay. And then what attracted you to the ocean part?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I think it's because I grew up in the desert. And I was like, I just want something with water, and I love to swim, and I love to dive. And I looked at civil like, regular civil engineering where you just build buildings and everything static. I was like, that's kinda boring. And I thought I want something that's more dynamic. And, you know, I just kinda went and took a bunch of classes and found out about ocean engineering, which was all about basically building, but in an ocean environment where there's all types of wave action and currents. And so all of these other things that you had to think about whenever you're building as opposed to just building a building that just stands there. And so that, to me, was really exciting.
Kim [:Yeah. So that was probably very attractive for the navy to want to bring you on.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:It was. Unfortunately, I never got to practice ocean engineering. They threw me straight into civil engineering, which was fine, which was absolutely fine. But I still love the pieces of ocean engineering that I could still bring to the fight.
Kim [:Yeah. Did you ever get to practice that later on?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Not so much on the ocean engineering side, but then I went back to school and got a PhD in geotechnical engineering. And that's all about engineering for earthquakes and understanding the ground and the ground movement. So whenever I went to Iraq, we were going out to all these little bases, and I found that I could really use my geotechnical background there because of the way that the silt had so much clay in it that they were just dumping water. And all of a sudden, an oasis would pop up. And nobody could figure out, like, why would they pour water on the ground? Why it doesn't just seep in? It was because there was a bunch of clay. And so all of a sudden, you had an oasis, and then you had bugs and mosquitoes and all kinds of other issues. And so I was actually able to use some of my geotechnical background when I went to my work.
Kim [:Oh my gosh. See, I see the little girl, that curiosity of you as a little girl coming out of there, as you were talking about, like, oh my gosh, why is this happening? Why are the bugs there? Why is this oasis coming up? And, oh my gosh. Okay. Okay. I have so many questions, but let's go back to where did you go to OCS?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I went to OCS in Pensacola, Florida. I had gunnery sergeant Ouellette in the United States Marine Corps, which as you know, that's one word. And, had such a great time. It really stretched me into understanding, like, what all I can do, because I had never been through something that rigorous. And, wow, I came out on the other end thinking, like, I might be invincible. Yeah.
Kim [:True. Because you said growing up, most of your family was all artists. And artists really don't have that very uniformed regimented schedule.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:It's true.
Kim [:Yeah. That must have been like a little bit of a culture shock.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I came home after OCS, and my whole family still didn't quite know what to do with me. Because I set up really straight, you know, whatever I was eating and just sort of my whole demeanor had changed. They really respected it. They're very supportive, but they again, they were just like, we don't know what to do with you. And then my mom got all excited because a couple of months later, I found out I was going to Guam. And so she was all excited that she got to go and and see me on Guam. But what's really interesting, though, is that my mom remarried and I got a stepbrother in this whole thing. And he saw how much fun I was having in the Navy.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:And he was like, oh, hell no. She can't go have all that much fun. So he stopped what he was doing and then he joined the Navy and he became a pilot. But since I was about two years old, well, two years senior to him, he was older. He would never ever salute me because I was his sister. I plan walking around as Lieutenant JG, and he's an Ensign. You know, we're out and, like, all of his friends are saluting me and they're like, you're not gonna salute her? And he's like, no. That's my sister.
Kim [:Oh my gosh.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I'm not saluting my sister.
Kim [:Well, that's so super cool though that you were able to inspire him.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:It was. And then I got my younger cousins also saw, like, all the stuff I was doing. They joined the army, but I have two cousins that joined the army. And I was, we are now a very military family.
Kim [:Oh my god. Look at the revolution you started. I know. And the theme that your family still doesn't know what to do with you.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:They still don't. They just accept me for who I am and they need a math problem or whatever. They just give it to me. I also program all their electronics.
Kim [:Oh my gosh. I'm having you over to my house too. So, yeah, let's talk about your career in the navy. So you went to OCS at Pensacola. And then after that, you said your first duty station was Guam.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Yes. In between, we have civil engineer corps school. It was about maybe three and a half months long, but they teach you everything you need to know about being a civil engineer corps officer. That's out in Port Hueneme, California, which is North Of Los Angeles, South Of Santa Barbara. So I was there, got to meet all the other civil engineers that were going through my year. It's about 50 of us, and they kinda threw us all over the world, but I got to go to Guam and I loved it. I'm a diver, I'm a runner, and there was this amazing group that was there and we were doing open ocean swims, like, every Saturday morning. And we were all doing triathlons.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I met a super handsome guy, and later he became my husband. I mean, it was absolutely fabulous.
Kim [:Oh my good. Yes. It sounds like you've had a really positive experience.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I did. I got to learn a lot. I worked with a lot of civilians. I I think the most fun part was that probably about six months after I'd gotten there, I was in charge of something like $36,000,000 worth of contracts all over the base there. And And I would call my friends back in Houston, you know, the ones that just went straight out and got and they're like, man, we're still, like, getting coffee for people. They hadn't really done anything. You know, they were maybe doing a little bit of design work, but I'm managing $36,000,000 worth of contracts. I mean, it's like, it's amazing what the military gives you.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:And, you know, it's like kinda like throw you into the deep end and you survive.
Kim [:Yeah. I have to agree with you. That is one of the beautiful parts of being in the military versus civilian world. You really get hands on training and more so than you would ever even imagine. And, of course, they give you all these different titles, which is amazing too because you get to learn a lot of different skills, which then you could all bring together.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:And it's true. For a civil engineer corps officer, you could be a contracting officer. You could be a public works officer. You could go to the CDs, which is actually where I spent most of my career. But you have all of these different things. And so whenever you come out, you're light years ahead of anybody who is in your previous year in college. I mean, because you have so much responsibility. You were learning so much so quickly.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:You were gaining all these leadership skills also that they will never even had a chance at probably maybe ten years from where you were.
Kim [:Yeah. I have to agree with you. It is such a beautiful part of the military. And then, well, we'll have to talk about that reintegrating back into society. But just so the viewers have an idea, because we're gonna go talk about how you were usually the only woman in the room. What years did you serve?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I started in '96, and I was able to retire in 2022.
Kim [:Wow. You did your full '20 oh, boy, Matt, twenty six?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Just right on '27.
Kim [:Oh, okay.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I guess it was 2023. So, yes. I'm like, how many years have I been unemployed? Yeah. Yeah. That's weirdly.
Kim [:Well, back then, I have to say I understand that error because I was in 1995. So, really, being the only woman in the room, let's talk about that.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:So I guess I should amend my ears. Technically, I did join in 1994. So the civil engineer corps, they hire you while you're in college, which is really cool. So I was like an e three while I was in college. So that's where the twenty seven years comes from, math. Okay. So being the only woman in the room, like, as you know, in '90 was it '93, '90 '4? That's when they first started women into combat roles. They could be pilots, and they could also be in the construction battalions.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I was only the third female officer in the battalion whenever I joined in '98. And honestly, they still didn't quite know what to do with us. You know, we go on these field training operations, and typically all of the male officers, they all have their tent, you know, and all of the enlisted males, they all have their tent. Well, there were so few females that they didn't know what to do with us, and they didn't wanna put the officers in with the enlisted. But it was like me and the supply officer were the only two females, and they couldn't give us a whole GP medium. And so they didn't know what to do. I mean, it was just, like, the, like, silly little things like that that you never really think about. Then they were thinking, like, do you need your own porta potty? And it's, like, no.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:We don't need our own porta potty. There was a lot of growing pains, you know, in the first couple of years that they had females in the battalion. But I would say right now, things are so good. Like, at least in the battalions, people are looking like male, females. Like, we're all just the same. And I think that's something that we can really say. But, you know, one of the first projects I had with the CVs is I went to Alaska and we are drilling and blasting. I was really the only woman there.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:The whole island, you know, we had some marines, we had the army, and then I had my group of civs. And I think there was maybe three women out of about 400 people on the island. You know? So you do get to be the only. And sometimes that can be lonely, but sometimes it can be pretty fabulous.
Kim [:Yeah. I was just gonna ask, how did you feel in that environment?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I loved it. I've always been one of those people who's like, I don't necessarily wanna be called out because I am a woman. I just wanna be a CB. I just wanna be an officer. I don't wanna be a female officer. I don't wanna be a female CB. I just wanna be that person like everybody else. And, wow, again, I just had so much fun.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I think if you're trying to separate yourself out, people will separate you out. But if you wanna say, hey, I just wanna be like everybody else. A lot of times, they will, and they won't segregate you, and they won't treat you differently than anybody else. And so I think with that type of attitude is one of the things that really helped me that, you know, they didn't just say, oh, you're over there. You're a female officer. We don't know what to do with you. They're like, oh, you're an officer. Just go over there.
Kim [:That's really amazing that you had that experience because I know there was a lot of females who, especially earlier on, experienced, like, the gender bias and sexual harassment, sexual assault, MST. So it's really wonderful to hear stories like this as well where the company sounded like they were really accommodating. Like, hey. Even though it was frustrating, I'm sure to be like, no. I'm just a woman. Like, I don't need my own latrine. I don't need my own porta potty, but it was nice that they were trying to accommodate you and make you feel very comfortable in that environment.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:And I would say probably 80% of the battalion was totally fine with us being there. There were about 20% that were not, and they were usually the older ones and, you know, it'd been in boys club all this time. And I will just tell you, there was an ops chief that we had and he was giving our supply officer a really, really hard time all the time. And I just finally had it, you know? So even though I'm a JG, I had went into the ops ops and I just dressed them down, like in front of everybody. And I was like, you want to pick on her? You go through me from now on. And after that, it was cool. Like he left her alone. Like he was trying to hit everybody to, like, you know, kind of go after this fly officer, like, not a good way.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:But after I just sort of went in and kind of laid down the law, you know what? Everything was okay.
Kim [:I love that you supported you supported that female officer and it probably made her feel empowered as well.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:And she stayed. You know, she was really thinking about this isn't for me. You know, I could go to a ship and that'll be fine. But it was just so new to have females where we were that after that, she's like, you know what? This isn't so bad. I wanna stay. And it was really nice to have her there. It was actually I could bounce ideas off of, you know, there's other times and she's just like, who else are you gonna talk to about some of these things?
Kim [:Yeah. It is really great. That female bond, that really healthy female bond is, like, a beautiful thing. So like you said, only having a few out there, it was really nice that you were able to stand up to her even though you there may have been some, like, repercussions for you. But the fact that you stood up for her probably showed her that, oh, gosh. Yes. I can feel safe in her care, and that was just really, like, a really positive act to do. So I could see how you climbed the ranks pretty quickly then.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Yes. I have a mama bear complex, so I think that's part of it. And it doesn't matter if you're females. Like, if you're under my care, like, I've got you. I think that's one of the things that did sort of set me apart was, like, I truly believe to succeed in the military is not about you. It's about taking care of your people. If you could take care of your people, you're gonna succeed. But you have to turn it on them as opposed to just concentrating on yourself.
Kim [:Yeah. So when did you realize that?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I realized that while I was in Alaska. And okay. So it wasn't all roses and rainbows and puppy dogs and all the things in unicorns. So I really, really messed up my very first job in the battalion. They made me the admin officer because they were missing an admin officer and they had to fill it. So they put an engineer as the admin officer. Like, that's the worst idea ever just to start with. But I didn't know how to lead people at that time.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Like I had led civilians and they were pretty easy to get along with. But then I looked at all my bosses. All of my bosses were yellers. And so I thought in order to properly lead troops, you had to yell at them. And so I tried that a couple of times and that was not me. I mean, there were days I would come home and it was hard. You had to think about my even going to make it in the Navy. If I had to like, just yell at people to make them do what I want them to do.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:And whenever I got to Alaska, I had a really, really great chief, and he basically pulled me aside. And he's like, I don't know what you're doing, but this isn't you, and whatever you're doing is not working. You need to figure out how to be yourself. And once I was given that opportunity to say, oh, I, I can just be myself. Oh, man. Everything started to click after that. It really did. And that's where I figured out.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:It was like, Hey, if I stop trying to be the big, bad officer and look at me and you do what I tell you to, and just realize, oh, I can actually be myself and talk to people and have conversations and then start to draw them in and get them excited about it and like have their ideas, you know, brought to the forefront. And, oh my gosh. Now everybody's starting to click. Everybody's starting to get excited. And it's like, oh, this is how you're supposed to lead. You know? You're supposed to be your authentic self. You're supposed to take care of your people. That's where I figured it out.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:But I had to have that chi basically pull me aside.
Kim [:You know, you said something so important right there because we just follow when we're young or we're put in unfamiliar environments, we kinda mimic what the higher up is doing, what the lead staff is doing. And so whether it's healthy or unhealthy, I think we know deep down, like you said, you have, like, that innate feeling. You're like, oh, intuitively, this isn't me. And so thank goodness because there's not a lot of people who have that chief to bring them aside and be like, hey. Just be you, and let me help you develop that you. Because we still don't really understand what that you is yet because we're so young, and the environment's new.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Yeah. You've never done this before. You know? So you don't have anything to really fall back on. So you just like you said, you just look to see what are your bosses doing. I guess, I work long.
Kim [:And that has developed you into what you do now, which is well, you started out as an inspirational speaker. Is that correct?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Mhmm.
Kim [:And grew this business of you now where, like, you have your own business. You go around the world and speak. Like, that is a huge accomplishment. I mean, I know you like you said, you're like this little girl still that is very unique and has her own unique gifts. But, like, when I read your bio and looked at your website, I was like, this is one of the most amazing, creative, intelligent, capable women, and I couldn't wait to speak to you. So, yeah, let's talk about how you transformed or how you transitioned from the military and then decided to make this global empire.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:And really thought about that, that I, Oh, unlike the emperor now, or the emperor.
Kim [:You are, you're the Empress.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:You know, after COVID and we're coming out of COVID and I was looking to retire, I was wondering, it's like, how do I still give back? There's something that I just and I love working with the troops because I could see them grow. I could help them be better than whenever they started. I could get them in the right training. I can mentor them on all of these things. And then I was retiring and I was like, I have to have something. And I decided, you know what? Maybe I should start speaking and a really good friend of mine. She's a very, very prominent speaker in The United States. I think she's the most booked woman, like, in The US.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:And she said, hey, have you ever thought about telling your story? And I said, no. It's like, I didn't even think about it. It was like, no. Then all of a sudden, that little seed started to it started to take root. And I thought, you know, I could help people this way. And that's what I started to do. And I went out and started to talk to people. I now started a coaching business.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I just finished a book, and I'm going around the world. I'm giving workshops. I'm giving keynotes. And there is nothing more satisfying than having somebody come up to me afterwards and say, thank you. Thank you. Like, I have been trying to figure this out. And I was like and then it clicked. And so thank you.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:And it's like, yes. I have, like, done my job today that I am helping others. That's what it's all about, man. I was put on this world to help as many people as I can, and that is what I'm going to do.
Kim [:I love that you found your gift. You've tapped into it. You had that support system and you went out and got it. But N I saw about the imposter syndrome, which I am so proud of you for being so vulnerable to talk about because Dakota and I, who are the creators of our nonprofit reveling retreat project and dog tag diaries, went through a women veteran entrepreneur class, and they actually had a full hour discussion on imposter syndrome. And thank goodness because all of us that were in the program felt it. So let's talk about the first time you got on stage, your first speaking event. What did you feel like?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I was excited. Actually, the way that I looked at it is like the people that were in the audience, they actually wanted to hear from me as opposed to whenever I would have to go and stand out at the battalion at 06:30 in the morning. Because nobody wanted to listen to me at 06:30 in the morning. But at least whenever I was on stage speaking, then I was like, oh, okay. Really, the imposter syndrome started to kick in a little bit later when I started to see the other speakers that were gonna be there, And I looked at how popular they were and how many books they've written. And I would start to think, what do I have to give? You know? And all of a sudden, you're all of that imposter syndrome starts coming in. It's like, well, I'm not that popular. Nobody knows me.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Would anybody even listen to me up there? And that's really imposter syndrome. And then I have to like, basically take a deep breath and think about all of the stuff that I've done in my life and realize, wait a minute. I have a mission and that mission is to help other people. And I have a message that can also help them as well. And so I was starting to think about stop making it be about me and make it be about the audience. And whenever I flip that around and said, no, I stopped thinking about yourself. Start thinking about how you can help other people. Okay.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I could like take a deep breath and realize, okay, this is going to be all right. But whenever you start to think about yourself and to pair yourself to others, oh man, you can get into that imposter syndrome spiral and it is hard to get out.
Kim [:Yeah. There's a transformational moment. Exactly what you just said. That is so interesting because I feel like when we are born, we have, like, this very open, alive spirit And no fault of anyone because they all have their own stories, but we're told maybe to bring it down a little bit, or maybe you shouldn't do that. And I just remember because as a little girl, I had this really big personality. I wanted to be an an actress and a singer and do all these things. And just because of my upbringing, it was a different, like, no. You go to college and you get married and you have kids.
Kim [:And so when I would go out for auditions, people would be like, well, who do you think you are? Michelle Pfeiffer? And I was like, well, I mean, she started from somewhere too. You know? Like, she was just a little girl with a dream as well. So, yeah, I kinda do. But after a while, like, people saying telling you, giving you negative feedback, it does give you imposter syndrome. You're like, oh, maybe I shouldn't be, like, so positive and thinking that every audition I go to, I'm gonna get or something like that. I, much like you along the way, realize, like, no. This is my gift. Like, I want to be able to give people those take my breath away type feelings on the movie screen and, like, be able to provide that, like, and now I transitioned into something else.
Kim [:However, I totally understand how you could have had that imposter syndrome, especially going to all these events, like you said, and speakers that you saw that you were like, oh my gosh, but they were in your position at one time too. Getting up on stage for the first time and probably saying the same thing.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Right. Most of the time we get imposter syndrome when we're trying something that's outside our comfort zone, We're trying something new. We're stretching our boundaries. A lot of times, if we're not growing, if we're not doing anything, we don't have imposter syndrome because we're not trying something new. We're just sitting and not doing anything. It's when we really start to say, hey, you know what? I wanna try something. I wanna do something new. That's when I found that I had this mean little voice in the back of my head that's like, what are you doing? Why are we doing this? You should just stop.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Everybody's gonna figure out you're a fraud anyway. So I get that mean little voice on the back of my head. I don't know if you have one, but, like, that starts to really chime in anytime I think about something new.
Kim [:Yeah. No. I like that message because you are correct. Dakota and I talk about this a lot too. Just starting this nonprofit and the podcast. Like, I was like, oh my gosh. How am I gonna do all this? Are people gonna even like me? Or am I doing this correctly? Like you said, when you transition out of that and you're like, wait a second. This is about getting military women's stories out there and helping other military women and then bringing together this community, that imposter syndrome goes away.
Kim [:So I do love that message that you have.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I also like to attribute it to the fact that we have to hear that mean little voice, but also what, what I've been writing about and what I speak about is we have this like inner warrior also, and that's the one that says, Hey, knock it off. And basically tramples that mean little voice. You know, that's the one that says, Hey, you know what? You can, because we all have that inside of us also, but we listen to that mean little voice as opposed to listening to our inner warrior that says, you can do this. You know you can. You've done it before. Maybe it's not this exactly, but maybe you've done something similar and you've succeeded, and you're gonna be helping people. And so what I try to do is succeeded and you're gonna be helping people. And so what I try to help people with is like figuring out who that inner warrior is and trying to strengthen that so that you can make that transition and say, hey, it's not about me.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:You know, it's about the people in the audience. So is this all part of your book? You know, it's about the people in the audience.
Kim [:So is this all part of your book?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Yes. This part of my book and it's also part of my keynote and my workshops.
Kim [:And what is your book called?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Becoming the Warrior.
Kim [:And it's already out?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:It'll be out in March of twenty twenty six.
Kim [:Oh my god. Okay. So you're gonna be doing a book launch next year.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I am.
Kim [:Okay. So we'll have to have you back on right before your book launch. Okay. Yeah. We can talk more about it.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:No. That would be fantastic. I'm really excited about this. I've had several people go through and read it already, and they're like, oh, wow. This is really helping. So I'm pretty excited about that because I've already had all of the readers kind of go through and, you know, it's another way to help people.
Kim [:Well, we have a question that we usually end the interview with, and that is because you give such beautiful, powerful advice, what advice would you give a woman in the military or thinking of going in the military or is post military as a veteran?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Can I give two?
Kim [:Yes. You can give as many as you'd like.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Okay. I would say first off, find a mentor. And that is so important. If you can't find one, find two. You know, there's a lot of times, maybe one mentor might have one portion of your life and another mentor might have another portion. I mean, I have five, just because, you know, I'm an overachiever, but they will help you. They can't hear your inner monologue or anything else. They know what's truth and they can help you.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:So go find a mentor. And then I would say the second thing that if I could give advice to anybody is just be yourself. If you are your true authentic self, you know, things are gonna work out. Might be a little rocky at the very beginning, but that's how I've succeeded in everything that I've done is I've just been my true authentic, genuine self. And I'm happy. I'm not feeling like I'm somebody else when you're frustrated and all of that. And it's just, just be yourself.
Kim [:I love that powerful advice because you're right. Being your most authentic self is so beautiful. And there is a journey to getting there, to learning all that. And there's different stages like you said. So to have those different mentors, can we hear about your mentors?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Absolutely. One of mine is technical, because I still do a lot of technical work. So he is all about helping me be on the cutting edge of a lot of different engineering projects. I have another one that's all about business and running businesses and how to be profitable and things you need to take care of. I have another one that's all about leadership. I was a former admiral that I greatly respect. And then I have another one that's about work life balance, which I probably need to call because I have been falling down on that a lot lately. So and it's just something probably I need to work on more than anything.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:And then I just sort of have, like, a general mentor. Like, you know, hey. I need to ask you some random questions that might not fit into some of the other categories. You know, because each one of these are so different. You know, the technical as opposed to work life as opposed to leadership. And so that's why I found that if I have a mentor for different aspects of my life, I feel a little bit more whole.
Kim [:Yeah. That makes sense. And I'm curious what you said about work life balance. What does that look like for you?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Oh, I need to work on it. I like to work. I really do. And if I can work a sixty hour, seventy hour week, I would actually probably be happy. But I have a family. I have a husband. I have two ginormous dogs and a cat. And I need to make sure that it's like, okay.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Even though I like to do what I do, I love them also. And I need to make sure that I'm being respectful and spending time with all of them as well, as well as friends and family. And it's something that I have to remind myself of. I am a recovering workaholic, and I have to remind myself. It's like, no, you know what? I can save this until tomorrow.
Kim [:Oh, I love that you're able to do that. You're right. Because it's not even really work for you because you found your passion. So when you're passionate about something, of course, you wanna continue. I know you're passionate about your husband and your two dogs and your cats and friends and family too, but you're right. You really can get I mean, you could be like, oh, yeah. I'm only gonna do three hours of this today. Six hours goes by because you're so passionate and involved.
Kim [:You don't even realize it.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Oh, I can be working, and my husband tells me that, you know, it's time for dinner, and I don't even hear him, you know, because I'm so involved in what I'm doing. You know? It's so, yes, it is something that I have to be very mindful of.
Kim [:Yeah. So what are some of the things you do to remind yourself or take yourself out of that work environment?
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I like to write list. List of everything that I need to do for the day. I know that you can't really see it because we're on a podcast, but just to kinda give you an idea, it looks something like this. You know, there's like all kinds of little boxes and things I need to do. And this is what I do almost at the start of every week. And it's like, this is what I have to do. But then I start to look and I have little timers that go off to say, hey, Do you really need to work anymore today? You know, it's 05:00 or whatever it is and take a look at the sheet and all of the different things I have to do and who requires what on what days and getting it all organized and say, hey. You know what? I'm drawing the long line right here.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:We'll get to the rest tomorrow. Nobody's gonna die. Everybody's gonna be okay if I turn this in tomorrow. I think one of the things about the military is it also gives you a really good perspective. Nobody is shooting at you today, hopefully. Nobody is shooting at you today. Nobody's trying to kill you today. If you don't get it done, you're not gonna get shot.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Do it tomorrow. It'll be okay.
Kim [:I was just gonna comment on that, Jenn. You're right because the military, you are in a very high demand fight or flight. I have to be on my toes so no one dies type mentality. So it's really hard to transition out of that to be like, oh, yeah. Just like you said, no one's gonna die today. Well, hopefully, no one's gonna die today. I don't need to be in that mindset anymore. And I feel that's just a conditioned response from being in the military.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I think it is. And I get I used to get so upset with coworkers because it would just get crazy about if there was different fonts on a PowerPoint. And there's, like, the world was ending. And I'm like, you know, this really isn't that big of a deal, guys. Like, nobody is going to kill you. Like, if you have Times new Roman as opposed to Calibri, like, it's gonna be okay. Like, we don't have to go to that type of extreme about worrying about the fonts on the PowerPoint. We can just get it done.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:We don't have to freak out. Stop freaking out. So I think that's a definite thing that the military has given us is our freak out meter is different than everybody else.
Kim [:Yeah. We definitely have to relearn that in order to reintegrate and be accepted more than the civilian.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Yeah.
Kim [:Into the civilian sector. Yes. Well, doctor Jenn, it has been so amazing talking with you and just learning about, like, how you were so different as a little girl and how that transformed you into this beautiful, intelligent, wonderful woman that you are today, just the global empress. We just nicknamed you, and we will definitely have you on for your book launch in 2026.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Oh, thank you. And you know what? This has been just such a really fun interview. And also, I wanna say thank you to you. It is so important what you are doing for all of your listeners and giving them hope and giving them ideas and helping them keep going, helping them transform themselves. So I wanna say thank you for all that you do.
Kim [:Oh my gosh. Thank you for giving me positive feedback. This is like woman power. Thank you very much. And I love that we have connected because, like, I get curious. I truly get curious when people connect to see why we connected and what we can create together. So we will have coffee in Bend. We will figure out our favorite coffee places, and we'll meet up soon.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:I would love that. Absolutely.
Kim [:Thank you again, Dr. Jenn.
Dr. Jenn Donahue [:Thank you so much for having me.
Kim [:Thank you for joining us on this episode of Dog Tag Diaries, where military women speak their truth and share their true stories. Every story told here is a step towards understanding, healing, and connection. Share this episode with someone who needs to hear it. And remember, your voice matters. Together, we're building a community that empowers, uplifts, and inspires. Stay connected with us. Follow dog tag diaries. Leave a review.
Kim [:And let's continue to amplify the voices of women warriors around the world. Your voice matters. Share your thoughts and reviews to help us grow, improve, and continue making an impact. Until next time, stay strong, stay true, and keep sharing your story.
